Monday, August 06, 2007

Terrorists and the Phoney War on Them

Let's get something straight, there are a fair number of people using guerrilla tactics against us in Iraq, that we don't like IEDs or lack of uniform doesn't make them terrorists, the actual terrorism in Iraq is being waged against Iraqis. Every now and then we get one or two of them and the BushCo goes off on a tear about how wonderful they're doing. There's a serious problem with calling that a war on terror. The terrorists who are a danger to the USA are somewhere else.

We have a pretty good idea where those who are a threat are hanging out, but George II has created a monster in Iraq. It's not Al Qaeda in Iraq, the second the US isn't in the way the Shiites will hunt down and slaughter them, the ones the Sunnis don't get to first. The monster he created is the perception of US troops as occupiers and "Crusaders." The way to deal with terrorist organizations is with small tightly focused and targeted operations utilizing specialists moving at high speed. What is wrong is that no Muslim nation with Iraq as an example is going to allow US troops in to conduct such an operation.

Yes, the BushCo "War on Terror" is a fake. Law enforcement had all the tools and all the information to stop 9/11 before it happened, legally. The fact that they didn't had nothing to do with spying on Americans or Habeas Corpus, it had everything to do with turf wars and incompetence. Afghanistan had everything to do with State sponsored and protected terrorism, BushCo tried it "on the cheap," and then took their eye off the ball with Iraq. If all that weren't bad enough they announced to the terrorists that they were coming and didn't use the previous resources available. (we had a lot of CIA, etc. in Afghanistan during the Soviet excursion).

We have, within the military and other, skilled, trained, and equipped people to deal with small scale terror organizations and we have the tactics. They are not utilized. What we have is George W Bush busy wrecking our military in Iraq on a mission they were neither designed for nor equipped for that has not one thing to do with terrorism. The specialized units are being misused in an environment they were not designed for and using tactics that are foreign to their function.

There are people in the world who would use terror tactics to harm the US, that is undoubted, but using them as an excuse to wage war in Iraq and on the civil liberties of Americans is criminal. Allowing them to exist unmolested for political gain is unconscionable. Using their existence for political purposes is...well, I have no polite words. BushCo and the Republicans are not tough on Terror, they take power and gain from it and do little to nothing to combat it, they are, in fact, its beneficiaries and allies.


Anonymous said...

You have said nothing new or insightful. What should we do in Iraq? What would be the consequences?

Jim Martin said...

Don't hate me, but I've tagged you to be the recipient of "The Pissy". A new blogger award. Right.
Anyway, come on over.

verasoie said...

Hey Chuck,

off-topic, but you'll have to forgive me.

You've presumably heard about your state representative, (R) Tom Butler, deciding not to run for re-election?

You're now the subject of some speculation over on Blueoregon, and it seems you'd have a fair amount of support.

Whad'ya think?

Steve Culley said...

We should leave. The consequences will be widepsread regional war. If we stay the consequences will be widepsread regional war. Both ways mean higher gas prices and economic dislocations. Leaving means that an Islamic culture is going to change. Like two old time western gun fighters the Islamic town is not big enough for Sunni and Shia. Outside influences have stopped or distracted them from sorting it out for decades. I say they are going to, with our approval or without it. Leave, save American lives and $$$$$$. The let's turn the phrase, "they can fight them over there and we can fight them over here" by closing our borders and finding those who aren't supposed to be here.

Garlynn Woodsong said...

Hey Chuck,

I second verasoie's comment -- your name came up as a qualified possible contender for the soon-to-be vacant OR assembly district (Tom Butler's), within which you presumably reside.

Your views, as evidenced by this blog, would seem to be a valuable contribution to the Oregon Legislature. I would encourage you to file and run for this vacancy, and would love to hear your perspective on it! I would assume that the proper place for this discussion would be here:


Anonymous said...




Last thing: your fing distributor is in the wrong spot.

BITE ME CHEVY BOY! you may delete.

Chuck Butcher said...

Before I deal with the subject of this post, I want to be clear, I might be able to do good things in Salem and I might actually be able to win as a Democrat in HD60, but a win would result in my personal economic destruction. I absolutely cannot afford to be a Representative in Salem. The US House would have been an extremely close thing economically, this is not do-able. I'll get to this other stuff later...

verasoie said...

Damn, it would have been great, but no one can fault you, and we don't expect you to martyrize yourself, even if it would be for a few months every other year. Keep up the good work as best you can. It's too bad our system doesn't remunerate our legislators in a many commensurate with the work that they do. I mean, what's the Oregon state budget, how many billions? And yet our legislators who make the decisions about how to spend that are paid what?

Steve Culley said...

The democrats had their chance to elect a gun totin democrat and somebody who tells it like it is. Instead you went with one from the blue part of the state. I question your reasons for wanting Chuck to run. You know he is at odds with the tradtional gun banning dominant wing of the party. Chuck would be a minority down Salem way and you know it. I think what you want is a bigger majority not input from the rural parts.
I think Chuck would make a fine independent.
I've mentioned several times over the last couple of years that Oregon's pay for legislators has to change. Only the financially independent can run and the commoner gets damn little representation. Goes for the Federal level too.

Anonymous said...

We should leave. The consequences will be widepsread regional war. If we stay the consequences will be widepsread regional war. Both ways mean higher gas prices and economic dislocations. CULLY SAID THAT.



MONEY AND GAS that all there is in a left-winger's thoughts?

Not you, or anyone you put up in 08 has the guts to hit back harder then they hit us....PC WARS get people killed.

For God's sake..if Bush was the devil you make him to be, he would have called that little slime in Iran, and told him the next IED,that went off in Iraq or anywhere a US soldier was in earshot..told him if it happen, that the phone he took the call on this matter would be hot plastic in 45 mins.

Not one of your possible people have the guts, WE WIN..WE CAN GO HOME NOW,IF WE FOUGHT A WAR TO WIN.

PS: What are you going to do with the 10 percent of one billion Muslims that want to cut your heads off??? ANSWER: NOTHING!

Chuck Butcher said...

And what exactly does any of this have to do with Iraq? No WMD, no active terrorists (minus the bunch in Kurdistan where we'd barred him, not squat. Now we've got Iraq al Qaeda who care about Iraq & the opportunity to kill some US troops and the Shia and the Shia who like to kill US troops.

the places there are international terrorists like Afghanista, Pakistan, Yemen, Somalia, Malaysia are nothing to Bush because they're not Iraq. YOUR insistence on Iraq leaves us less safe and less active against international terrorism. You may have noticed I have no problem with guns, I have no problem with the military and using it, I do have a problem with BushCo stupidity and the propaganda that makes Iraq a deal it isn't.

Chuck Butcher said...

Pol Pot was a direct outgrowth of our interference in Cambodia, not a result of us leaving Viet Nam. BTW, we won every pitched battle in Nam and held virtually nothing. Without the population's help and cooperation you will just keep fighting for the same ground. The Nazis did it a little differently, they scared hell out of the populace, gassed them, executed them, it sort of worked.

We make more enemies in Iraq than we kill, that is not how you defeat anybody. Stop, relax, think, some people are getting very rich and powerful off trying to scare you.

Anonymous said...

What are you going to do with the 10 percent of one billion Muslims that want to cut your heads off??? ANSWER: NOTHING

As usual...the company line!

Really exoected more, but a least you never let me down.

1."Militants Attack Government Targets in Central Yemen"

2."USA - Former CIA Director: Terrorist Strike Within U.S. Real Threat - Bombing Iran an Option."

3."PAKISTAN - 14 Taliban suspects held - arms seized."

4." USA - New Al Qaeda threat of radioactive truck attacks naming New York Los Angeles Miami."

5.1/17/91 * Two days after the start of the last war against Iraq in 1991, Iraqi agents tried to blow up a U.S. government cultural center in the Philippines. The bomb detonated prematurely, killing one Iraqi and severely injuring another. In the aftermath, the United States discovered more than two dozen Iraqi agents throughout the region.

1/30/91 "[America] will not be excluded from the operations and explosions of the Arab and Muslim mujahidin and all the honest strugglers in the world."-Saddam Hussein

2/15/1991 "Every Iraqi child, woman, and old man knows how to take revenge...They will avenge the pure blood that has been shed no matter how long it takes. Baghdad Domestic Service, February 15, 1991 (State-controlled)

circa 1/1/1992 1992 - Bin Laden established legal businesses in Sudan, farms, a tannery, and a construction firm, to increase his available funds, and as fronts for al Qaeda camps he was organizing there.

circa 1/1/1992 1992 - Osama bin Laden made a proposal to his rivals in the pro-Iran Shiite terrorist organization Hizballah that they set aside their differences, so that they can cooperate in a common objective of killing United States troops stationed in Asia and Africa.

12/1/1992 December 1992 Yazdi, Turabi, and Bashir agree to begin planning and preparing various terrorist attacks to be conducted in close coordination. These attacks included an escalation of attacks against US and UN forces in Somalia and (later) against the World Trade Center in NYC.

12/29/92 Bin Laden's first attack against US-two hotels in Aden, Yemen

1/1/93 In 1993, the Iraqi Intelligence Service (IIS) directed and pursued an attempt to assassinate, through the use of a powerful car bomb, former U.S. President George Bush and the Emir of Kuwait. Kuwaiti authorities thwarted the terrorist plot and arrested 16 suspects, led by two Iraqi nationals.

2/1/1993 February 1993 Yazdi, Turabi, and Bashir present their plans to Iranian terror experts in a meeting in Khartoum, Sudan. The Iranians approve, and the attacks are ordered to proceed.

2/26/93 World Trade Center bombed by Al Queda

3/1/1993 Spring 1993 Mohammed Farah Aidid meets with Iraqi intelligence officials in the Iraqi embassy. Baghdad promises to aid him in his fight against the Americans with the explicit intent of turning Somalia into another Vietnam for the Americans.

3/1/1993 Spring 1993 Saddam Hussein viewed the operations against the Americans in Somalia important enough to nominate his son Qusay to personally supervise them. The other elements of anti-American operations apparently didn't support this idea. Those other elements included Bin Laden and his Afghan Arabs, the Iranian-backed Al Quds forces, the Iranian Pasadran, and the Sudanese. Iraqi intelligence reported that Saddam wanted a "Mother-of-all Battles victory in Somalia." After these reports and after Qusay's nomination, the Iraqi embassy in Khartoum, Sudan was expanded by the addition of several different Iraqi special intelligence services branches and special security branches. Those new additions were under the control of Sudan's leader Hasan al-Turabi.

GEEZ's not all Bush lies.

Get this straight....Clinton had Osama picked out of a crowd(like a sore thumb) he refused to pull the trigger. I hate PC COWARDS!

Bush can't spend all the money nor Cheney, the "blood money" you are so full of excrement he is supposed to be making in ten lifetimes.... I, again will nail your butt to a cross with hard data, as long as you do the "bubba" 101 deny-deny crap,

you lose the debate.


Chuck Butcher said...

As for Clinton, the Repubs called it "tail wagging the dog" and put the kibosh on it. Same bunch that pooched 9/11 and etc. Nice try, get a blog of your own.

Anonymous said...


You can run,(you know the rest)

When are you gonna really come up with something?

How many pardons did Bubba give?

Who is Mark Rich?

When will you do as you say?


Get this straight....Clinton had Osama picked out of a crowd(like a sore thumb) he refused to pull the trigger. I hate PC COWARDS!

While Bush sucks on the border, while he hasn't got OBL, READ MIKE YON'S BLOG...Then get your blog up to date. We are killing them where we find them(just as he said we would do) He hasn't stopped looking for OBL..Happen to know personally a JTTF guy from PDX.

I know Chuck ,the JTTF guy listening to all your phone calls...Maybe Savage is right...IT IS A MENTAL DEAL after all, and I should FEEEEEEEEEL,more about your fears of the JTTF...but I DON'T!

Mark Rich...??? how many pardons dod Bubba give? You just seem to have failed that quiz for some reason.

Chuck Butcher said...

did Anon 10:51 find some words of priase for Bill in the post? Just exactly what is it that BC has to do with GWB? If I bring up Hitler does that have something to do with GWB or BC? Well, let's see, Hitler invaded Poland on manufactured (incorrect) evidence.

BushCo and GeorgeII offends you? Then find somebody that isn't deserving of the appellations. Evidently you haven't noticed that as easy as it would be to put other names on the Republican Party, I don't tar them with the brush of their leader or their theocratic base, that's because there are plenty of principled Republicans, they just don't run the show. BushCo is a tool of the plutocrats and favored Corporates, thus BushCo - see their policies. GeorgeII - Richard I had the Magna Charta rammed down his throat for being an autocrat, it included little jems like Habeas Corpus, your kinglet seems to have forgotten. JTTF is a freaking joke and has to do something to justify its budget, like stir you up. If what they were doing amounted to squat do you think they'd talk to YOU about it? Just so you can post it? You expect me to take seriously an Anon poster's second hand relationship to an unattributed JTTF? You've got to be kidding yourself, I'm real careful with major news outfits and what I say. You provide joke links to reactionary sites with discredited news and I'm supposed to take that seriously?

You have now bored me. The Republican Congress put a stop to Clinton's actions against OBL, half-hearted as they were, a blow job was their concern at the time. There were NO WMDs in Iraq, the "UN" inspectors told BushCo it was unlikely that they'd missed them, Saddam provided several tons of documentation saying they were destroyed, Bush wanted and had his war. We now produce terrorists faster than we can kill them at the expense of the Iraqis, you back one of the most cowardly actions taken by an American admin, we had no stake in Iraq. We had a huge stake in Afghanistan and still do, along with Nuclear Pakistan, but nooooo, let's mess around in Iraq.

BTW, there is an "Other" button in the "choose an identity" push that and give yourself a name. Or go play where somebody will take you seriously as Anon. I back my play with my name & picture and I'm real easy to find, but I'm no pussy, either. If the Feds don't like what I have to say, it's pointless to listen to my phone, I put it right our here in public and my ass is kissable.

I've stated before that in politics it is best to treat an opponent with respect, you may have common ends at another time, making enemies is foolish, but recognize the ones you have, GWB has created an implacable foe in me, his disregard of the Constitution and warmongering and general disrespect for the oppostition guaranteed that we have no common ground. I consider him terrorism's best tool and complicit in their aims. Take that however you like. I'll get off his back the day he's in a prison.

Anonymous said...

JTTF is a freaking joke and has to do something to justify its budget, like stir you up. If what they were doing amounted to squat do you think they'd talk to YOU about it? Just so you can post it? You expect me to take seriously an Anon poster's second hand relationship to an unattributed JTTF? You've got to be kidding yourself, I'm real careful with major news outfits and what I say.

Hey Chuck: The JTTF guy I KNOW, in PDX, has located a young (middle eastern type) not an old BUSH FACED LIBBER MENTAL CASE, that shipped 5,000 rds of .50 CAL from PDX(A SANCTUARY CITY, RUN BY A BUNCH OR TERROR LOVING COMMIES to Houston TX.that got into the wrong hands of not so nice people.

And like that idiot Randy Leonard here...he doesn't have to tell you s---!

Your not really as intelligent as you think....a bunch of possible terror events have been stopped...MONEY STOPPED, COMMUNICATIONS STOPPED... AND THEY HAVE NO NEED TO INFORM YOU OF SH-T!

You do as you please there BOY, my money is on the guy I KNOW working there,at least he is in favor of stopping them first, not after we "talk nice!"

And YES,Chuck ,they did talk too me...LONG STORY, I found the kid first, and reported it.

Anonymous said...

The Republican Congress put a stop to Clinton's actions against OBL???????????


He just walked away from his first job, that of national security??? He wasn't a great multi-tasker then? What was it he did do CHUCK?

I'M BORING YOU??? a joke, right!

Chuck Butcher said...

so they've done their job and skeert you, so what? I am so underwhelmed by your obsessive fear and Clinton mania I have no words. WJC is not POTUS GWB is. WJC is not my concern at this point. While he was busy being an ass, be was.

Anonymous said...

underwhelmed by your obsessive fear and Clinton mania: Chuck said!

See there Bro, that's what I fear have no fear, sometimes dumb people have no fear ,and they cross I-5 at rush hour and don't look both way's.


Bet you never understand that at all.